tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post4062853191554936555..comments2024-03-23T04:23:48.076+00:00Comments on Tandleman's Beer Blog: A New Way For Micropubs?Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger25125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-2945769238631022432015-11-06T16:40:05.542+00:002015-11-06T16:40:05.542+00:00This has already been done just down my road in sh...This has already been done just down my road in sheffield. We already had one micropub, now welbeck abbey brewery have opened one on the same street called portland house in an ex greggs type bakery shop. It has four or five of their beers plus a couple of guest ales, one "craft keg" tap and pilsner urquell. Its quite a nice place to have pint. I have no idea if it would fit any definition of micropubAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10521951039095355648noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-13277789127029580382015-11-06T13:38:02.054+00:002015-11-06T13:38:02.054+00:00I'd like to see a micro-sandwich/soup-café wit...I'd like to see a micro-sandwich/soup-café with a few cask ales on. What would we call it?<br /><br />One avid "NFL" "micropub", the Bouncing Barrel, has such a strict no-phones policy that the landlady stopped me from looking up one of their beers on my smartphone. Had to go outside.<br />Erlangernickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09564871714656285737noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-20180843439695862712015-11-06T08:40:59.664+00:002015-11-06T08:40:59.664+00:00Mudgie said:
Also my guess is that many of them ar...Mudgie said:<br />Also my guess is that many of them are to some extent hobby businesses and don't generate enough profit to provide a decent income on their own.<br /><br />Well the two in our branch area - all be two which are on the large side of the category - are doing very well for their owners. One has paid off all the debts incurred to open it within a year and is investing heavily in improving its offering and the owner of the other is using her success to open other businesses - her second (non-beer related) on way and currently looking for her second "micro-pub".GeordieManchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03926305998637585626noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-20529257887550221662015-11-05T19:05:42.497+00:002015-11-05T19:05:42.497+00:00Missing the point, but never mind - it's not t...Missing the point, but never mind - it's not that important.Neville Grundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10923209266005338452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-33899751893275351242015-11-05T16:59:54.271+00:002015-11-05T16:59:54.271+00:00Nit picking. How do you know the website isn't...Nit picking. How do you know the website isn't quoting Martyn?Tandlemanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06804499573827044693noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-27626175810360921692015-11-05T16:42:00.606+00:002015-11-05T16:42:00.606+00:00Sorry TM; you wrote: Martyn Hillier (right) sees t...Sorry TM; you wrote: <i>Martyn Hillier (right) sees them as a big thing for the future and even has a definition of what a micropub should be "A Micropub is a small freehouse which listens to its customers, mainly serves cask ales, promotes conversation, shuns all forms of electronic entertainment and dabbles in traditional pub snacks"</i> You clearly credit the quote to Mr Hillier, not the micropub website.<br /><br />The micropub website says, among other things, that "the definition of a Micropub is difficult. It is a set of ethics rather than a set of rules."Neville Grundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10923209266005338452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-43981954234785173442015-11-05T14:55:58.534+00:002015-11-05T14:55:58.534+00:00Nev. No I haven't got the wrong end of the sti...Nev. No I haven't got the wrong end of the stick. I am quoting from the Micropub Association's website. I say "it is an easy enough concept to grasp and has to be followed by any micropub that aspires to be included on the Micropub Association's Directory." It is they who are defining it and if you want to join their association, then that's what you have to comply with, though whether that is in whole, in part, or in the spirit of, I do not know. <br /><br />Nor do I defend the definition, or say I agree with it, or infer in any way I don't approve of it. I am making a wider point, which to me seems clear. That is, would this distort the vision and would it actually work? I say - and it is true - " This more or less completely overturns the unique selling point that our friend Martyn Hillier devised, of the micropub being a free house." What I was trying to elicit was views for and against and any problems that might arise.<br /><br />Finally what Martyn writes in WB does not alter what the Micropub Association's website says and it is that I quote.<br /><br />Tandlemanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06804499573827044693noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-48047012611414482482015-11-05T14:28:54.114+00:002015-11-05T14:28:54.114+00:00I haven't been to anywhere that specifically m...I haven't been to anywhere that specifically markets itself as a micropub. But here in Leeds Northbar have opened a number of small suburban bars, I think there's four so far. The size certainly makes a difference - it's much more comfortable if you just want to go and read a book on your own for instance. In lots of suburban areas the pubs are too big, and a lot of the ones that have survived are essentially family restaurants, so it is nice to go somewhere where it is just for a drink. Though it must be said they are still very much middle class hangouts.Robnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-49233542943313745002015-11-05T13:33:19.984+00:002015-11-05T13:33:19.984+00:00I'm afraid you've got the wrong end of the...I'm afraid you've got the wrong end of the stick, Tandleman. You have quoted, not Martyn Hillier's definition of a micropub, but his description of his own micropub. He wrote in November's <i>What's Brewing</i>: “There is no set formula or design to the micropub. They vary in size though all are small.” CAMRA Liverpool Branch declared in the GBG that the Liverpool Pigeon in Crosby was Merseyside's first micropub as it is “true to the formula”. As there is “no set formula” (M. Hillier), they neatly and erroneously excluded the older Inn Beer Shop in Southport. It's typical of some in CAMRA that they have created a hard and fast rule where none was provided or intended.<br /><br />The idea of Moorhouses opening micropubs is comparable to the big supermarkets moving into the convenience store market. A convenience store owned by Tesco is still a convenience store. As there is no definition of a micropub, I can see no reason why Moorhouses can't use the term for any they may open, especially as they have said they would provide guest beers. You can be sure that, regardless of whether you disapprove of calling them micropubs, that is what they will be called by many of the drinkers who will use them.Neville Grundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10923209266005338452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-35397101997106124422015-11-04T22:35:24.767+00:002015-11-04T22:35:24.767+00:00Bulkwineandspirits.com is a portal to promote trad...Bulkwineandspirits.com is a portal to promote trade relations between professionals and <a href="http://www.bulkwineandspirits.com/products/bulk-spirits/bulk-whisky/" rel="nofollow">bulk bourbon</a>, alcohol derivatives, and encourage business transactions between them.Maruhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18405294872854912953noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-78398103192552605342015-11-04T13:33:28.959+00:002015-11-04T13:33:28.959+00:00If a regional brewer, such as Moorhouses, buy a pu...If a regional brewer, such as Moorhouses, buy a pub-whatever the size, then it's not a micropub, is it? A basic tenet of micropubs is that they are free of tie. Moorhouses are simply going down the traditional brewery-owned pub route, albeit with a little twist, that they have been down before. If I were them I would be asking myself what happened to our original estate? Their pubs have always sold guest beers, anyway, btw.<br /><br />If Moorhouses want to see how to build up a small estate of well-run pubs, then they should take a look at Allgates. Sat In A Pubhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08123038980796000837noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-50253529174478363912015-11-03T20:26:57.125+00:002015-11-03T20:26:57.125+00:00but I think the problem is what some people are no...but I think the problem is what some people are now labelling or claiming as micropubs, are actually no different to pubs that are just small to begin with. Ive been in several pubs smaller,the Nutshell in Bury St Edmunds for one for instance, than most micropubs Ive been in so far. And successful pubs large or small always focus and know their target market.<br /><br />So I do struggle to see either the size element as their key success point or that theyve unlocked some magical unheard of business practice called giving customers what they want, but maybe its my perenial complaint about people extrapolating their local market conditions to a grand nationwide scale and deciding thats the blueprint for successStonohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02656315721111561414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-68943183930813964802015-11-03T19:28:22.670+00:002015-11-03T19:28:22.670+00:00I would drink in a gaff full of retro games. I'...I would drink in a gaff full of retro games. I'd want retro beer too. I'd want a can of Hoffmeister and Kokotoni Wilf on a ZX Spectrum. Happy days.Cooking Lagerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02830924433230427226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-43479726558793309662015-11-03T18:57:57.396+00:002015-11-03T18:57:57.396+00:00Or possibly one full of people using retro home co...Or possibly one full of people using retro home computers?<br /><br />If nothing else it'd make a change from everyone messing around on their phones.DaveSnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-59619948502458018152015-11-03T18:43:37.917+00:002015-11-03T18:43:37.917+00:00I'm gonna define it as pub for midgets, create...I'm gonna define it as pub for midgets, create a proper association of micro pubs, and sue all the ones with full sized tables and chairs.Cooking Lagerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02830924433230427226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-45399243197080698742015-11-03T17:24:02.455+00:002015-11-03T17:24:02.455+00:00Most of the micropubs I've been to seem to be ...Most of the micropubs I've been to seem to be run by the middle-aged for the middle-aged, opportunistically taking on small cheap buildings. Nothing wrong with that if they do it well, as they seem to. Same for the clutch of off-licence-cum-bars popping up in places like Glossop and Southport, general with a younger catchment. They all show drinkers can last for an hour or two without food.<br /><br /><br />I'd like to see Moorhouses be able to sell their beer in top condition; it's rarely the best selling beer in a multi-pump range. Don't know if a micropub will do it for them. Incidentally, Oakham's flagship pub in Peterborough is enormous.<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-76606422828836672562015-11-03T16:25:59.011+00:002015-11-03T16:25:59.011+00:00Two thing here -
Firstly, I think the basic reason...Two thing here -<br />Firstly, I think the basic reason that micropubs have been successful is that they have a target market, they know their target market, and they focus on getting the offer right for that target market rather than trying to do everything but mostly doing it badly. That's an idea that's pretty obviously got legs even if the target market (and hence the offer) isn't always exactly the same.<br />Secondly, once people get the idea that a micropub is like a pub but micro, I'm not sure that the Micropubs Association have got much more chance of regaining control of the concept than the United Craft Brewers have of enforcing a definition of "craft" or CAMRA have of stopping people referring to bottles of Spitfire as "real ale". And to be honest, I don't see that this is a problem - if being a free house and having at best a second class wine offering is a precondition for success then these "micropubs" won't get far, if not then who cares what you call them?DaveSnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-20390297512416693722015-11-03T15:48:51.617+00:002015-11-03T15:48:51.617+00:00I'd say part of the appeal of micropubs is tha...I'd say part of the appeal of micropubs is that they are non-corporate - it's not simply a concept that a brewery can pick up and run with. Also my guess is that many of them are to some extent hobby businesses and don't generate enough profit to provide a decent income on their own.<br /><br />We're seeing a lot of new small café-bars opening up, some of which sell decent beer, but they're not micropubs.<br /><br />Have you been to visit the new micropub in Cadishead yet, the Grocers? (no, me neither) <br /><br />Oh, and as the great American science fiction writer Robert A. Heinlein said, "If you would know a man, observe how he treats a cat."Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-42661568804628786702015-11-03T15:48:23.858+00:002015-11-03T15:48:23.858+00:00I've always been very fond of pussy cats. Go...I've always been very fond of pussy cats. Got me in plenty of trouble over the years. Scratches etc.Tandlemanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06804499573827044693noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-23324415766211232902015-11-03T15:18:14.936+00:002015-11-03T15:18:14.936+00:00Spot on.
Pedro I am really disappointed you'r...Spot on.<br /><br />Pedro I am really disappointed you're a cat person. Not very manlyStonchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07001578598975666535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-27018304716547406412015-11-03T13:53:34.569+00:002015-11-03T13:53:34.569+00:00Bailey and Cookie. Sitting at different ends of th...Bailey and Cookie. Sitting at different ends of the spectrum I see. Cookie, it may be a last dying gasp, but hey, if it works......Tandlemanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06804499573827044693noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-40101963077755722692015-11-03T13:03:16.076+00:002015-11-03T13:03:16.076+00:00Quite apart from the evangelism they evoke, Microp...Quite apart from the evangelism they evoke, Micropubs do seem to get to the nub of a problem: many pubs are too big and so, even with quite a few people in, lack atmosphere. Without having to sign up to Micropub Association's manifesto, opening pubs in smaller (cheaper) premises seems to me like a smart move, especially in small towns and villages with lots of empty shops.Baileyhttp://boakandbailey.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-19020580926022901492015-11-03T12:46:14.685+00:002015-11-03T12:46:14.685+00:00Interesting post and comment so far, ties in the t...Interesting post and comment so far, ties in the the piece by Hillier in this month's What's BrewingAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-65853133233240417352015-11-03T12:34:38.769+00:002015-11-03T12:34:38.769+00:00It sounds to me from the description that these ar...It sounds to me from the description that these are replicas of Edinburgh's Bow Bar. What sets them apart from a small traditional pub with a good selection? No spirits?Alanhttp://agoodbeerblog.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8629758183547510158.post-62674358300436253272015-11-03T12:31:00.479+00:002015-11-03T12:31:00.479+00:00I have no problem with people enjoying a drink in ...I have no problem with people enjoying a drink in a gaff that happens to be the type of thing they like. More power to it. I do laugh at those that think micropubs represent a turning point in pub interest or signs of recovery when they are the opposite. They represent the segmentation of pubs into defined niches, in this case a perfect CAMRA niche of all the things CAMRA types typically like with none of what they don't. No problem there, everyone to their own. They represent the decline, not the resurgence. Small pubs dependent on a tax advantage? A last dying gasp.Cooking Lagerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02830924433230427226noreply@blogger.com